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 POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden

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Should the Inferno move the Beer Garden?
Yes
80%
 80% [ 16 ]
No
10%
 10% [ 2 ]
Don't Care
10%
 10% [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 20
 

AuthorMessage
GraceTX

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Location : Plano, TX

PostSubject: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:02 pm

The Inferno has the option of moving the Beer Garden for the rest of the season and we need input from members on whether they want this to happen or not.

We've talked to the front office and other supporters groups in the beer garden and have cleared the way for this to happen IF this is something that the membership wants to do.


Edited to add that the poll will run through May 18th.


Last edited by GraceTX on 5/10/2012, 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:25 pm

Personally I think this is a good thing for the inferno to do so I am supportive. It is with a slightly heavy heart though as I won't be able to join you 90% of the time as I have my girls. I am going to assume no one under 21 is allowed in there right? I will maybe move around to Wayne's corner and soak up the atmosphere from there Smile my neighbour Nick, who I go to the games with and likes a drink, likes this idea.
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The Inferno

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Location : Texas

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:29 pm

We realize that we have underage members and are working with the front office to see how we can get them field access. You may be right about sitting in the section next to the beer garden for much smaller children.
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:33 pm

I really appreciate that! My kids are of course wee things so that's not a big concern, but do we have many members who are say 16-21 who this would affect more?
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The Inferno

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Location : Texas

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:35 pm

Killer, Mason, and Travis are all U-18.
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Rex Kramer

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Location : RIP Bobby Rhine

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 2:40 pm

One thing I do want to make clear is that we are moving to the Beer Guardians turf if this goes ahead. As such, we are not going there to make it our own, but to work with them.

Kasey and the other BG leaders and I had a good long chat after the game last night. Like me, they are very interested in unifying the groups and making the beer garden field seats as similar to the idea behind the Cauldron in Livestrong as possible. Their approach to the game is very similar to ours, and this is a big reason why I feel the beer garden is going to be the best fit for us.

We need to make sure we are moving with the right attitude - not "This is what we're going to do" but, "How can we help make this work and grow?"
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 3:44 pm

I feel like I have an oddly unique perspective on this, as I'm both the grizzled old fart who's spent 17 years supporting a team and also the newbie who just moved to DFW a couple weeks ago.

The veteran in me recalls that Inferno has spent most of it's time behind the goal (1996-98, 2003, 2005-08) and done so successfully. I also recall that we've spent a lot of time actively lobbying for beverage discounts, stage access, and a looser atmosphere re security. All of these things are happening on the garden. We shold declare victory and plant our flag where it belongs.

The rookie in me says that behind-the-goal is the home of supporters in Chicago, New England, New York, Toronto, Columbus, Kansas City, Colorado, Los Angeles, and Portland. Why aren't we doing what works for them?

As for the concerns of under-21s, I don't give a rat's ass. Inferno was never meant to be a family-friendly location. Our biggest battles over the last few years (which we have consistently lost) have been that we're offensive to minors. Are we now going to make our last battlefield defending the very demographic that has almost brought us to our knees?

Are we going to be the group trying to make the garden friendly for children when we were the group that argued loudest and longest against the bounce house?

To quote some dead chick, I believe the children are our future. As a corrollary, I believe that they are not our present. Go to 101, join El Matador, stay in the wedge; I don't care. Call us when you turn 21 or can afford a passable fake ID.
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 3:51 pm

Parrish wrote:


As for the concerns of under-21s, I don't give a rat's ass. Inferno was never meant to be a family-friendly location. Our biggest battles over the last few years (which we have consistently lost) have been that we're offensive to minors. Are we now going to make our last battlefield defending the very demographic that has almost brought us to our knees?

Are we going to be the group trying to make the garden friendly for children when we were the group that argued loudest and longest against the bounce house?

To quote some dead chick, I believe the children are our future. As a corrollary, I believe that they are not our present. Go to 101, join El Matador, stay in the wedge; I don't care. Call us when you turn 21 or can afford a passable fake ID.

I think your going off the deep end a bit for someone who doesn't give a rats ass. I initially brought up the minors questions, and as you can see I said I think this is a good move for the inferno and I will fit elsewhere with my kids. As for teenagers and u-21 adults, if they are paying/participating members of the inferno they at least deserve a little respect and consideration. Not saying the beer garden should become accessible to them or change its rules, but maybe a solution for active inferno members who will no longer be able to join their inferno friends is something to think about. I am not personally saying ANYTHING should be changed. But, on the other hand, there is no need to be disrespectful.


Last edited by scottishbeagle on 5/10/2012, 4:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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GraceTX

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Location : Plano, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 3:52 pm

We're not talking about making the beer garden a family-friendly location. We're talking about 3 specific teenagers (Mason and Travis Carmichael & Elizabeth (Killer) Hottle) who are already in the wedge with the Inferno or who have grown up with the group and the atmosphere.

And, I disagree that our biggest battle has been that we're offensive to minors. We are offensive to soccer moms. I don't think this will be a problem as Mason, Travis, and Killer all attend games with their parents who know what you get when you sit with the Inferno.
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mudpoet

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PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:02 pm

Edit: I didn't read what others posted before composing this, so there's some repeat.

To the Officers: Have you spoken with the front office about the idea of allowing U-21s in the beer garden? I'm sure we've all been to a bar or 100 where they stick a wristband on you or mark you with a stamp after the 1st time you've been carded. If they are worried about having a ton of U-21 down there, an idea would be to only allow those that are part of one of the SGs. A supporters group ID card can handle getting them to the stage. I bet y'all can think of a few other ideas if you put your heads together. There may be red tape laid out by the TABC, but it's worth looking into. With this solution, the decision to move is a LOT simpler.

The Split: Accept it. Some of the group has already left. You can keep the official location, but that's not going to bring the ones that left back to the wedge. You can change the official location, but there's no way the entire group makes the move. There will be those that prefer the sight lines of the wedge over that of the beer garden, there will be those that cannot move due to either being U-21 or being with U-21s, and I'm sure there's a myriad of other reasons.

Focus: You've got two options: 1) amputate and grow one location over the other, or 2) focus on both locations. For as long as I've been a member, The Inferno has maintained the viewpoint that you don't have to stand with the group to be a member of the group. One option is to go a step further and have TWO official locations. This will be difficult, but it's possible. Personally, I think the group should opt for #1.

The U-21s: It may be short-sighted to only consider the current number of U-21s that will be affected by the move. Although the current group doesn't show it, some of the easiest recruits are in the 16-21 range. I can name a lot of current supporters who joined the crazy section that was The Inferno while they were U-21. Here's some of the big guns: Daniel, Amy, Gina, Harlan, Matt, etc. At the peak of their insanity, they were all heavily involved in the group, and they were all U-21.

Recruitment: This should already be a focus, and I'm not sure what the group is doing today to make it happen, but I think it is especially important right now, since the split is done.

Future 21s: As the U-21s graduate to drinking age, they're going to want to hit the beer garden. This is a downside of having two official locations. As the wedge recruits U-21s, they will also lose the graduates. The size will likely remain stagnant. In my opinion, this is HUGE. If you can't grow the wedge, and you've got built-in growth at the beer garden (graduates WILL want to try out the beer garden), then I think an official beer garden location is in order. This is one of the reasons I voted to move.

Expansion/Growth: This is a minor downside to the beer garden, as The Inferno is pretty small at the moment, but the beer garden has limited space. Based on what I've seen on TV, it gets pretty full as-is. You can only expand so much.


Final Thought: Whatever the group decides to do, I think the decision needs to be made objectively and with a vision of the future. Also, don't stay in the wedge out of stubbornness, and don't try to force any existing supporters in the beer garden to do things "your way". In the end, we all want to support our team. Nothing else matters.


Last edited by mudpoet on 5/10/2012, 4:13 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:02 pm

scottishbeagle wrote:
I think your going off the deep end a bit for someone who doesn't give a rats ass. I initially brought up the minors questions, and as you can see I said I think this is a good move for the inferno and will fit elsewhere with my kids. As for teenagers and u-21 adults, if they are paying/participating members of the inferno they at least deserve a little respect and consideration. Not saying the beer garden should become accessible to them or change its rules, but maybe a solution for active inferno members who will no longer be able to join their inferno friends is something to think about. I am not personally saying ANYTHING should be changed. But, on the other hand, there is no need to be disrespectful.
I think section 101 with Wayne's group would be a great place for the 16-20 demographic. I realize this means excluding Killer and the mini-nards, all of whom I enjoy spending time with. And I'll be happy to tell each of them directly that I'm willing to sacrifice their game presence to revitalize this SG.

I spent time in the garden last night, and think it's perfect for my vision of Inferno without any changes; therefore, I don't want to make any. If underagers get access to the section, there will need to be something along the lines of bracelets or continued ID checks. I dislike hassle, I dislike complexity. We increase the risk of running into issues with underage drinking that could put the kibosh on the whole set-up. And most importantly, we open the door to the whiny little shits and their shitty little parents who have been breaking our balls for every f-bomb and a-hole chant for years.

My initial post came across as bit strong, and I recognize that. But as you can see, this is an issue I feel passionate about. I understand your disagreement and I respect your opinion, but I still stand by mine.
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:08 pm

Parrish wrote:


I spent time in the garden last night, and think it's perfect for my vision of Inferno without any changes; therefore, I don't want to make any. If underagers get access to the section, there will need to be something along the lines of bracelets or continued ID checks. I dislike hassle, I dislike complexity. We increase the risk of running into issues with underage drinking that could put the kibosh on the whole set-up. And most importantly, we open the door to the whiny little shits and their shitty little parents who have been breaking our balls for every f-bomb and a-hole chant for years.

My initial post came across as bit strong, and I recognize that. But as you can see, this is an issue I feel passionate about. I understand your disagreement and I respect your opinion, but I still stand by mine.

LOL at the bold bit Laughing

I respect your opinion also, and in fact agree with a lot of it. I would like to think the fact the beer garden is physically separated from the rest of the stadium would help create a nice buffer zone between f-bomb dropping supporters and the "shitty little parents" which would HOPEFULLY help eliminate this issue. last night the wedge was the emtiest I have seen it in the 2 years I have been going to matches here, and there were STILL people to our right who complained that the drum was too loud. they did us all a favour and moved elsewhere clap
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:11 pm

mudpoet wrote:
The U-21s: I can name a lot of current supporters who joined the crazy section that was The Inferno while they were U-21. Here's some of the big guns: Daniel, Amy, Gina, Harlan, Matt, etc. At the peak of their insanity, they were all heavily involved in the group, and they were all U-21.
I think we can all agree that Matt cancels out the other four.

This is a concern for me, honestly. Yet we all know that Inferno is more than just the in-stadium experience. Road trips, tailgates, watch parties are a big part of indoctrination to our little group. For the generation you mention, I'd say that extracurriculars were more important than what happened in the stands. I like the idea of a simple beer garden, free of adult supervision and complications. If we can achieve that, I'll be on board with it.
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:11 pm

as mentioned above, I think we would all agree there is a difference between the U-21 members who come with their families/on there own to the inferno section, and whiny brats who think it looks fun and actually detract from the experience of others down there by being a pain in the ass.

perhaps some sort of bracelet system where u-21's who are members of the inferno can have access to the garden is the way forward. Obviously I have no idea what the TABC would find acceptable or not.

Do they ID every time in the beer garden? do we know for a fact no u-21's are allowed?
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mudpoet

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PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:16 pm

Parrish wrote:
I think we can all agree that Matt cancels out the other four.
If you're serious for a moment, I think you know that's not true. Matt may be a pain sometimes, but he's a die-hard who contributes to the group in a mostly positive way.

Parrish wrote:

This is a concern for me, honestly. Yet we all know that Inferno is more than just the in-stadium experience. Road trips, tailgates, watch parties are a big part of indoctrination to our little group. For the generation you mention, I'd say that extracurriculars were more important than what happened in the stands.
I completely disagree. While that may be true for some U-21s, I don't think for a second that it's the reason Daniel and Harlan were involved at the level they were.

Parrish wrote:

I like the idea of a simple beer garden, free of adult supervision and complications. If we can achieve that, I'll be on board with it.
Me too, especially for the reason in bold.
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mudpoet

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PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:17 pm

scottishbeagle wrote:
Do they ID every time in the beer garden? do we know for a fact no u-21's are allowed?

Last time I attended a game, they carded you before you could walk down the steps.
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:18 pm

scottishbeagle wrote:
I respect your opinion also, and in fact agree with a lot of it. I would like to think the fact the beer garden is physically separated from the rest of the stadium would help create a nice buffer zone between f-bomb dropping supporters and the "shitty little parents" which would HOPEFULLY help eliminate this issue. last night the wedge was the emtiest I have seen it in the 2 years I have been going to matches here, and there were STILL people to our right who complained that the drum was too loud. they did us all a favour and moved elsewhere [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
The Inferno section was emptier last night than it has ever been. Ever. In seventeen years, we've never had a turnout that sparse. I've been to Open Cup games with an attendance of 1,000 that still had 30-40 Inferno (all standing). I attended mid-week Southlake tilts that had over 25 standing Inferno. Last night, there were less than 20 in section with 5 standing. It broke my heart. Having this news announced today has rejuvenated my spirit.
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GraceTX

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Location : Plano, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:18 pm

Let's be clear on this, we're not talking about access to the beer garden for U21. The FO and TABC are not going to budge on that. We're looking into field access via some other entrance point for U21 members.
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:20 pm

mudpoet wrote:
Parrish wrote:
I think we can all agree that Matt cancels out the other four.
If you're serious for a moment, I think you know that's not true. Matt may be a pain sometimes, but he's a die-hard who contributes to the group in a mostly positive way.
No, he's the living worst. The AT&T of people.
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scottishbeagle

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Location : Providence Village, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:27 pm

GraceTX wrote:
Let's be clear on this, we're not talking about access to the beer garden for U21. The FO and TABC are not going to budge on that. We're looking into field access via some other entrance point for U21 members.

thanks for clarifying Wink
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Keylock25

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Location : Mckinney, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:28 pm

I support the move to the beer garden as I am a part time resident of it myself. We have always dreamed of creating a unified supporters section and creating the scene our club deserves.

I know the move is going to be tough for our U-18's, but remember this is about what is best for the group. The law of oligarthy has always taken the initial concern when it comes to making the decisions for the group. I would hope the members of the Inferno would be looking for a way to grow together in creating something nobody saw coming.


Dallas 'til I Die
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Parrish

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Location : FtW

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:41 pm

GraceTX wrote:
Let's be clear on this, we're not talking about access to the beer garden for U21. The FO and TABC are not going to budge on that. We're looking into field access via some other entrance point for U21 members.
This pleases me.
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Tex-Micks

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Location : Richardson TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 4:44 pm

I agree that something needs to be done as the turn out in the wedge was pityful last night and on sunday. I believe it is best for the Inferno as a supporters group to move to the beer garden. It would be nice if there was a chance for the younger ones to get field access via another route but I guess until then Aenghus and I will continue to go to our usual spot or move over to 101.
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Hammer

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Location : Plano, TX

PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 5:49 pm

I never wanted anything but great things for the Inferno and it has been sad watching the wedge die over the last few games. I moved to section 101 because of my new baby who is 7 months old. Plus I have realized that I am too out of shape to do what a 21 year old does anymore.... although I still give it a good try.

We formed Red Shamrock because we love being "supporters" of FCD and want to continue being positive for this team! We didn't just want to sit in the shade (as some have said) and we chose 101 because of it's proximity to the BG. I want my daughter to be able to stand with the Inferno in the future and I think this is a major step in the right direction.

So if the move does happen, anyone who still wants to be close enough to the action to cheer and sing and also wants to school their kids on how to be a supporter, has a home with us in 101. We stand the whole game and we sing and chant the whole game, and we love teaching our kids, and the people around us that this is responsible parenting. Most of you are gonna have kids someday and you can use 101 as their training ground.

I'll say this though. We ARE NOT your BABYSITTERS! You come with your kids and you BE a responsible parent and watch your kids. You also better bloody teach those kids that being a supporter means effort with the singing and chanting as we will not put up with "hand sitters". We look forward to any who want to experience the atmosphere of the BG without the spillage of the BG and you will find a welcome in 101.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
also a member of...
RED SHAMROCK
The FCD Family Supporters Group
"All Little Bastards are F***ing Welcome!"

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Jagle

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PostSubject: Re: POLL: Should the Inferno Move to the Beer Garden   5/10/2012, 5:49 pm

It's a little hard to stand out as the original SG from the deep end of someone else's pool. Certainly there's not much room for signage down there. Until United Airlines calls me up, can I continue to hang our stuff in the wedge? I don't mind if I'm the only one there, it will maintain the clear identity of our outstanding and historic group. Besides, when El Capitain returns, I'd prefer to be at the far end when our guys score.

Actually, if you can talk the FO into it, it should be easier to haul the smoker down to the stage. I'm sure that somewhere on the northeast side is a freight elevator that might be of use when the guys set fire to the second half of the season.
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